Further Information on BCTI

I posted on the BCTI school closure back in March and again in April, but haven't had a chance to get much more information since then...until now.  :-)

The lawsuit against BCTI, brought for breach of contract and violation of consumer protection laws, currently includes 49 former students of the school.  The judge for the case has ordered that $300,000 in assets be seized from the owners of the school to be held for possible judgements should the lawsuit be successful, apparently stating that he found it likely that they should prevail in at least some of their claims. 

This article by David Wickert in the Tacoma News Tribune is noteworthy in actually detailing claims and providing information regarding the problems behind the closure at the school.  As I said originally, schools in Washington and Oregon are required to give notice of closure and provide training for current students until graduation.  More serious problems come to light in the article:

In February, an Oregon Department of Education investigation concluded that BCTI misled students about its program, admitted students who could not benefit from the training and submitted inaccurate graduation and job-placement statistics to the state. The agency put BCTI on probation.

Washington investigators found evidence of falsified admission tests that allowed unqualified students to receive financial aid. They also found BCTI representatives illegally recruited too close to an unemployment office in Olympia.

And in April, the nonprofit agency that accredits BCTI barred Jonez and Pigott [the owners of the school - ed.] from operating accredited schools, citing substandard graduation and job placement rates, reporting violations and questionable recruiting practices.

Putting a school on probation is usually extremely effective in either making or breaking that school.  Schools on probation are generally given a set time period to comply with certain standards or recommendations, and if they do not, the next step is being denied accreditation, which results in ineligibility for government financial aid, as well as losing credibility as a valid educational option.  I would guess that the February probation was a major factor in the school's closure in March if the operators knew they would be unable to comply with accreditation demands from either the state or their non-profit accrediting agency. 

Normally, I would chastise the non-profit accrediting agency for not barring Jonez and Pigott earlier, as the information they cited had to have been available to them earlier than the school's closure date.  I don't blame them, however, as there are currently lawsuits against a Southern regional accreditation agency regarding denial of accreditation to an unqualified school.  Until those cases are decided, waiting until the state board moves against a school is simply self-preservation.

While I am in agreement regarding the seriousness of the charges quoted above and contained in the rest of the article, I have to say I'm not too impressed with this type of thing:

They [students - ed.] say the program provided the kind of basic computer training they could get from a book. They say BCTI officials promised a program leading to high-paying jobs, though some wound up working in retail stores and fast-food restaurants after graduation. And they say BCTI recruiters preyed on welfare recipients, the homeless and other vulnerable targets.

If the students could get the training from a book, why didn't they?  If the value offered by the school was that bad, why did they pay thousands of dollars for it?  And since when does one blame a recruiter from school for one's inability to get a certain type of job?  That's like going to Weight Watchers and then suing them because you only lost 35 lbs. instead of as much as the lady on the TV commercials did.  On the other hand, if the recruiters promised that the education would make you qualified for a certain type of job, and when you finished, you discovered that you were NOT qualified, and not through lack of effort on your own part, then I would agree with the students.

[Originally posted August 2005]

Comments

[Christi Ezell]

Hoi does a student who completed the program in Aug. of '99 see about getting some money back from the program? I completed the 720 hrs. w/o missing ANY time, was promised a good paying job in the end, and was not able to get a job at all. Little did I know I would be expected to start out at $8.00-9.00/hr and probably have to go to Seattle (commuting from Tacoma, paying for either the bus or parking in he city). For that little amount in starting out I wouldn't even have broken even, much less ever be able to pay back my loan. I feel that I was toatlly taken advatage of and ripped off.

[Shauns]

As one of the litigants I can say I am suing because the school did not even follow their own cirriculum and I never once set up and configured a Windows 2000 Server (beyond a basic internal domain) or a Novell server. We were supposed to do many things we did not do. I amk also suing because the school used illegal training aids (pirated software) and other factors as well.

The training I expected to get in the one part of phase 2 I wanted was absolutely useless and the amount of total misinformation proved to me that BCTI deserved to go out of business. My lawsuit is over inadequate training and since we never even did what we were supposed to do in class I have a legitimate case.

[Heather Johnson]

I went to BCTI and got absolutely nothing out of it but harrasing phone calls from the student loan departments. I was told upon registration that they would base my financial status on how much i made. But they ended up going by how much my father made! therefore i ended up having 2 student loans to pay back! The teachers didnt really know what they were doing in class. Most students ended up teaching them. Some of the teachers left because they felt it was "wrong" what they were doing to us. I wanted to leave the school but i was promised a brighter future and so with that in mind i stuck to it till the end. I graduated and went on numerous job interviews all which ended in the employers saying things like.. You went to BCTI? Sorry but we don't hire people who went there because you dont have enough experience!. So it was back to the Daycare job i tried to get out of before. And than the people from BCTI would come to my daycare job during the day and harrass me because i wouldn't sign some paper work they wanted me to. The Monterey financial bank who one of my student loans was through has harrased me to know end. I cannot pay them back the thousands of dollars i owe. For starters im not even working and i havent been for a year now. BCTI should drop all the students who "Owe" because it wasn't our fault that we got stuck in a dead end school that led to dead end jobs. and now we are stuck paying back loans that we can't afford. All because of their lies to us.

[Heather Johnson]

Just another little thing to say about BCTI..With the promises of a new career and moving forward in a great paced work world. People say we could of learned it outside of the school..Well a little known trick..If you go to BCTI and than drop out a few months in...You still owe the money big time!!! which is totally unfair! And they dont like if you visit the school and ask to talk to other students about thier views on the school before you sign up..

[Jayne]

Hi there. I found contact information for some of the class-action lawsuits against BCTI for you guys. Hope that helps!
~Jayne

Pierce County Superior Court Civil Case 05-2-05763-2
Case Title: ANITA WRIGHT VS. BUSINESS COMPUTER TRAINING INSTITUTE INC

Member Name Darrell L. Cochran WSBA Bar # 22851
Law Firm Gordon Thomas Honeywell ET AL Admit Date 10/15/1993
Address 1201 Pacific Ave Ste 2100
PO Box 1157
Tacoma, WA
98401-1157 Status Active
Phone (253) 620-6531
Fax (253) 620-6565
Email dcochran@gth-law.com

For Oregon:
Charles Robinowitz

1211 SW 5th Ave # 1150
Portland, OR 97204
Phone: (503) 226-1464

[Brandon Reeves]

It is a sad thing, to have trusted individuals such as (schools) prey on those seeking a better life and education. I attended the BCTI Fife campus here in washington, and let me tell you. About 1/3 of the way through, I could tell, that I knew more than the teachers did, which was a reason i was at the top of the class. But when I enrolled into BCTI it was constued upon me that "their" training was the "best" and through "BCTI" I was going to recieve the education and experience to go to the top of the corporate ladder. As they put it in my interview. And that thought sparked my interest, and before I knew it I had paid over 4,000$ in cash and had sighned on the dotted line. What a mistake! But realising you've been duped when it is too late, sure makes you feel helpless, doesn't it? And these damn government loan snakes, just won't let up. I don't care if I go to jail, they aren't seeing a penny! BCTI needs to be held accountable, why don't they count how much money they gained? I wasn't even qualified for a student loan, I MADE too much before I went in! Now tell me that isn't bending the rules? Perhaps a tad? I want to bring these S.O.B's down, anyone know where I can find information on this I want my money back and compensation for this BS we've been put through. If anyone has infor PLEASE send it to my email, and I will reply Just_Harris@msn.com. If the school was what it said it was, I'd pay Uncle Sam back, because I love this country, but Uncle Sam if your listening, we were both duped!
-Brandon Reeves-

[Amy Chase]

I worked for BCTI for about 2 years and I definitely have mixed feelings about the experience. In every graduating class, there were almost always "a few" students who found what I would consider to be good entry level administrative positions -- usually these were the smartest, most capable students who could have gotten good jobs without the training but did not know how to conduct a job search or didn't have confidence in themselves. I heard a lot of students rave about the school and how much it had changed their lives.

But there were many other students there who clearly could not benefit from the training and should not have been there. Yet teacher's pay was based on student retention and so we were -- to put it mildly! -- pressured to try to keep these students in the program even if they didn't actually learn a thing. It was an extremely unethical situation and I am not too proud of myself for staying as long as I did.

Students do need to take responsibility for not reading the fine print when they signed onto the program. The recruiters may have painted a bright picture of their prospects but they still should have insisted on knowing the facts about their payment obligations and exactly what the curriculum was, etc. After all, the recruitment does include a tour of the school, where you can observe and are encouraged to talk to the teachers.

Turnover among staff was incredibly high. I am not exaggerating when I say it was not unusual for entire departments to experience 100 percent turnover every few months. It was ridiculous.

It may be hard to gather the facts to prove their case, but in my opinion, the owners should be assessed stiff penalties because they basically got rich by manipulating poor people to gain access to US government student aid funds. I've meet them myself ("Morrie and Tom" I think their names were) and they consider themselves very religious and righteous but they can't see their own hypocrisy. Pathetic.

[Susan]

I worked in the ****** office for a short time. During that time I was exposed to all the different levels at the school. It was clear, shortly upon my taking the job, that despite their "concern for their students and their futures" this was a school with only one concern and that was "butts in seats" for money.

There were several very unprofessional and questionable incidents between the director with both staff and students.

On the level of students, the teachers never seemed to be motivated or supported to take action against any problem students, and there were several. Before I made up my mind to leave, I was aware that there were some strange ways in which the Career Advisors were working with the students. Most of the students who graduated seemed to be in jobs that never made use of their skills.

The recruitment staff was always under the gun to get as many people to sign up as possible. Some of the people they brought in clearly would never be able to work computers, or they would only ever be entry level. The staff was treated with contempt.

I finally left that position as I could not in all good conscious work for a company that had such questionable business ethics.

let alone all the perverted teachers that screwed and i mean "screwed" the students. I know cuz i'm one of them. and he screwed my aunt, best friend, and aunt's sister in law, and others. and he is married. wow. i should take his a** to court too.

this school is sick and demented all around. what the heck were they teaching there anyways? man, good thing they got put out of business. hopefully all you students get your loans dropped. good luck to all. man, i feel sorry for his wife.

[Tamara Graff]

I attended BCTI in FIfe, WA and graduated in 1998, I heard about this school, called them and set up a tour to find out more. When you get there, you tour-ecouraged to speak to the teachers...teachers have even stated that they were "encouraged" to convince us to attend- so talking to them wouldn't get us honesty! Then while you're excited of the bright future climbing the corporate ladder you've just been promised, they get into the office and "talk" you into signing the papers before you leave... maybe that should have rang a bell but honestly you're just thinking about the great career you're going to get to provide for your family. I remember in Modular 1- I actually annoyed my teacher because it was typing basic letters and stuff.. they didn't have enough curriculum to keep you busy, several of us walked around and helped the others for lack of anything to do. And when I applied- I have moved here a month before, living with my dad with my 2 kids after a divorce, no income at all to speak of and got recruited and promised a great future with a career with room to grow up the ladder. Did they mean working as a gas station clerk with advancement to what "lead cashier", now that's definately worth $9,000.00! My loans were based off of my fathers income, which WAS NOT my income. And I'm one of the ones that they claimed as a success story, I had spoke to my "career advisor" about checking into designing web pages from home, then at graduation I was "encouraged" to stand up and speak about how I was successful as I would be designing web pages from home. Also, in the middle of modular 3, I had gotten pnemonia and was really ill, so I had to miss 3 weeks, when I returned they had me restart modular 3 with the class that was actually behind me when I began. Which seemed fine except that my original class was the last class to go through using an old application, so upon graduation I didnot have the same education as my graduating class because they learned totally different, newer applications in Modular 1& 2. My husband- who I didn't even know when I attended BCTI- his tax return was taken from him after we got married because of my loan that I can't pay because I was supporting my 2 kids on $8.00 an hour as a cashier at a truck stop. If I were to enter a contract with someone stating that I would provide specific skills and didn't follow through with my end of the deal, wouldn't I be held accountable? I believe that we were misled to what we would receive from BCTI and that there was some serious wrongdoing in several circumstances in my case as well as many others. I know no one who got the big CAREER we were convinced by BCTI that we were going to obtain. Shouldn't BCTI be accountable for at least part of our loans? I do believe that they should be accountable for something more than a certificate that means absolutely nothing to a prospective employer for they have no way to verify attendance, skills or graduation. $9,000.00 for a piece of paper that is the basic plain Certificate designed paper, so I may as well have printed it myself! Which I could have done before attending BCTI!!!!

[Sher Fenn]

*Note: This post has also been placed on ripoffreport.com

I'm glad to have finally found this place. It took a little bit of searching, but my girlfriend and I definitely have a story to tell as well.

My girlfriend and I met while she was in the middle of her Phase II "education" at BCTI, Salem. She had started Phase I a couple of years prior, but had to leave midway due to pregnancy complications. She restarted after the baby was born with a fresh new 10K loan (the previous one had not been discharged).

After completing Phase I, she was contacted by the school and they asked her to return to attend Phase II, which she did, whereby adding another loan to the existing pile, of which she was consistently paying.

The first time I picked her up at school, I was a little shocked to discover that it was actually located in a strip mall. It seemed odd to me that the school had no major capital assets.

A couple of months later, she mentioned that the school was still using Windows 98 o/s. I was alarmed that the school hadn't updated their operating systems to Windows 2000 (by this time it was 2002). I mentioned that it was a little unsettling that a technology school didn't even utilize the most current technology. I then asked her if she would be receiving her MCSE (Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer) or some other industry standard certification (A+, N+, etc.). She said the school promised her that she would receive these certs when she was recruited, but she checked into it.

The next day, two weeks prior to her graduation, she learned that she would receive a "BCTI Certification of Completion". Any additional certs would have to be taken and paid for indpendently.

For anyone who is unaware of what is required for an MCSE (and this is only one of the many different MICROSOFT categories a person can get certification for), there are 5 core tests required and 2 elective tests. Each of these tests cost big $$ (around $150 apiece) JUST TO TAKE THEM and if you fail, you don't get your money back.

She graduated from BCTI in October of 2002. Once she was out the door, she was pretty much forgotten. She had to hound BCTI Career Services for help and the help she got was job leads for minimum wage service jobs. She had several hits from the Oregon Employment Department for lucrative networking jobs for Oregon State University, Linn-Benton Community College and some City of Albany jobs, but she discovered, through the interviewing processes, that she was still vastly underqualified. By December of 2002, she was completely discouraged and filed for deferrment. By 2003, BCTI rumors were flooding the area and she defaulted on her student loans, of which she still owes about half ($15,000).

I don't blame her. If I received that kind of terrible service, I wouldn't pay for it either. Consumers do have rights. Unfortunately, that default will haunt her forever unless she can get them legally discharged. People can NOT file bankruptcy on Federal Student Loans.

After poring through the posts that I've found on this site for a fraudulent misrepresentation report that I'm doing in my Business Law class, I have to say that I am completely stunned and appalled at the ratio of instructor postings that fail so miserably in grammatical standards and overall professionalism.
I'm disgusted at the marketing methods employed by BCTI and terribly saddened by the way the company treated their more qualified and ethical employees.

If anyone reads this who is considering a private trade/business school, please consider the following things prior to putting your name on the dotted line:

1) Capital assets: this means that the school actually has a CAMPUS. Not leased, storefront property in a strip mall or a fly by night Internet document mill.

2) An itemized graduation checklist: Get one and then take it to your local university, community/junior college to check it against their requirements. All businesses will recognize an Associate's, Bachelor's or Master's Degree from a state certified school. Always. Employers might not take a little known private vo/tech school certification seriously.

3) Consider where you were recruited: If it's at a government facility for underprivileged people (like the Department of Human Services office, County Mental Health, etc) or a drug rehab facility take it to someone within that office for some consultation. Most DHS offices already work in liason with local community colleges and if you're serious, they can really help you out.

4) Consider the cost: Folks, I'm a dual enrolled student at Linn-Benton Community College and Oregon State University. At a minimum, through my community college, I pay about $1000 a term for my classes and about $400 a term for books. There are 4 available terms each year. This equates to $5600 a year, if you go year round (this means going during the summer). There are generally (6) terms to complete for an Associate's Degree. This equates to roughly $8400 for a bona-fide Associate's Degree. My girlfriend had to pay $10,000 for a single phase. Each phase took about 8 months to complete.

Do the math yourself. The consumer really got ripped off through BCTI.

5) Talk with any Career Guidance center BEFORE enrolling. Ask for a list of companies they work with and CHECK UP ON IT. If they won't provide a list to you, something is being hidden and you should run for the hills.

6) Talk with their Financial Aid department. If the only financial aid that you can get is a student loan, go to another school. There are literally billions of scholarship dollars each year that go uncollected -- your community college can really help you here. Remember -- you have to repay a loan, you don't have to repay a scholarship or grant.

This has gotten very long-winded, but I hope it helps someone in the future. I would hate to see another person have to go through what my girlfriend (and, as a result, myself) has gone through.

Best of luck.

Sher
Albany, Oregon
U.S.A.

[Rasheeda]

I attended BCTI located in Beaverton, OR in Feb 1997. I dropped out of high school and received a GED at 16. Within a few months I enrolled in the courses at BCTI. I was really excited about attending because upon touring the school it seemed like the instructors were very helpful and would be able to meet my needs, expectations. Upon completion of my loan paperwork I was asked for a $75 fee, which the recruiter said it was for my certificate when I graduated. I gave him the money. As the weeks went on, our curriculum grew shorter and shorter and class would end an hour or two earlier than what was scheduled. I began to realize that everything that I was being taught, were skills and applications that I already knew. When I spoke to the recruiter about it, he assured me that in the later weeks we would be taught new tecniques and skills that I could benefit from in my new career. My mom began to question why I had been able to get a student loan at 17 without parent consent. In the final days leading up to graduation I felt really discourged because I had not learned anything new. On the day before graduation a recruiter called me to tell me I wasn't going to graduate because I did not pay the $75 fee. I informed him that I did pay, I had given it to a recruiter who actually quit two months earlier. He told me the school had no record of my payment and if I wanted to get my certificate I had to pay again. I did not pay again, I have no certificate. I am very upset I was taken advantage of. Now I am stuck with a $6700 loan in default (balance remaining from $8000)I cannot repay because I am unemployed without any marketable skills to get a good paying job. I really want to go back to shcool to get a Master's in Business Admin but can't because I have this defaulted loan I can't and don't want to pay because I was used and misled from the beginning. What am I supposed to do now???

[anonymous]

hey everyone, great news, go to www.gth-law.com and join the class action suit against BCTI

[Tony Curry]

I'm happy this company will finally have it's day in court. Someone posted they couldn't believe the agency which granted BCTI's accreditation didn't know about what was going on. Part of that reason is because they were being lied to by the administration office in Gig Harbor. Once a few of us realized what was behind the veil we contacted everyone from newspapers, government, news stations, and ACCET.

From time to time I see ex students and some former employees of BCTI because I still live in the community. For years BCTI got away with ruining people's lives, now I'm glad the role is being reversed.

[Damian Gomez]

I thought that taking a shortcut throuht BCTI was the way because they talked about all these advanced jobs we were going to be able to go work at. I am a very motivated young man that is not going to let anything get in his way. BCTI put me in a position where i had to start from step one. Im in debt about 20,000 and im only 22 with now real collage education. Im all on my own and i am an imigrant from mexico. Please help!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Tera]

I was single and with one child outside the welfare office when BCTI hit me. I fell for it, I needed what they promised to get myself on my feet. The only good thing I got was I met my future husband in class. Now he is doing very well, that has nothing to do with the training he got at BCTI. I stay home with kids, but after I graduated I did get a receptionist job paying 7.00 an hour! so 900.00 a month was what I made to live off of to take care of me and my son at the time. My husband and I always say, that it cost us $20,000.00 for us to meet eachother. How do we get involved?? thank you.

http://www.oregonlive.com/business/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/business/115776330489230.xml&coll=7

[Julie Messerer]

I graduated from BCTI (7-month "basics" course) in 2001. I'm still paying my loan off. I know of at least one classmate of mine who will be highly interested in the class action lawsuit.

As for me, over half the classes were worthless. The real kicker was when one of the instructors wrote a teaching manual for Microsoft Access!!! To this day, I have no clue what to do with that or QuickBooks (very poor instruction). Oh, not to mention what I categorize as a personal assault by my "professionalism" teacher who is supposed to teach ethics!! (He was removed after I talked with another teacher about it and other women had come forward as well.)

The only "good" thing that BCTI did for me was lead me to one job (which I quit when they wanted me to do things not in the job description--such as clean the bosses' offices, do Safety meetings with the guys--this was a road construction company, which I was hired to be a receptionist for!!) which prepped me for another one that I have now, using skills I did not learn from BCTI. I'm still stuck paying my loan off (at least it's down to $5000 now).

I should go for that Class Action Lawsuit to get rid of the rest of my student loan!

[Yves P.]

0498B Pres.
If you know what I'm stating here, send me an e-mail.

Thanks

Yves

[Da'Vonya Jackson]

I am so glad that I have found this website. You just dont know how long I ve been searching for more info on this class action suit and Im glad to say.......Ive joined it. Man BCTI, was such a rip off. I attended the Tukwila, Wa location and graduated April/2002. And like many others, I also had hopes of pursuing a better career, and BCTI promised that was something they were gonna help me with. Unfortunately, thats not how it went! Throughout the whole time attending that school, things seemed kinda strange. Teachers here today gone tomorrow, the poor curriculum and the financial advisors were crooks. Even my mom said that she thought my advisor was a crook. He told me that I would receive some grant money because of the income level i qualified underneath. So he kept requesting all this info from my mom, saying this is what he needs to get me my 2000.00. So like any other normal person, I got happy and went to my mom for the info. She starting to think something was suspicious. Anyhow, I get all the info over to him, just to have him start ignoring. I would stop by his office and he was never there.

My mom even left several voicemails for him, and got no calls back. Unfortunately, I got into a car accident, which kept me out of school for a couple of weeks. The money that I was looking forward to receiving from this so called grant, still never showed up. Finally seen the guy, and he said "oh, you never got the money?" I was like "no". Right then, I knew I had to go. I was so ticked off, and to top everything off, I graduated but never received my certification.......what a ripp off! So, I would tell people dont ever consider going to this school, but no worries.....because their "Closed"!

contact the law offices of Gordon, Thomas, Honeywell at
253-620-6529 talk to Heather M. Spencer or email hspencer@gth-law.com
they are doing the class action suit and want all students to get involved. they don't get paid till you do and if you don't get paid they don't.

[gimme a break!!]

Went to the school in 1997 and you want money back because you hear there is a lawsuit! Sheesh.

[gimme a break!!]

Went to the school in 1997 and you want money back because you hear there is a lawsuit! Sheesh.

[Stephanie]

I attended BCTI in 1995 in Lacey. I went to find out what this school was all about, they asked my if I had a dipolma or GED, I said I do not. Had me take some kind of test, said I passed. I never did see the results.I struggled the whole 7 months to keep up, got through it. Nine days later I end up having carpel tunnel sugery and then about 4 or 5 months later I had the other wrist done. I was never able to find a job cause I couldn't type fast enough for the job. I deferred on my loan so many times cause of hardship. The loan department hounding me all the time. Even after I told them that had become disabled they told me i was disabled before I started, yes mentally, but over the last 6- 7yrs I have become phiscally disabled there are days when I cannot even move. The loan dept. was very rude to me the last time I spoke with them. BCTI caused me nothing but grief!!!